Tanking on a champion seemed nearly impossible before Rise of Isengard. While the champion did have three stances most players stayed in Fervor and didn’t bother with the others because they were not as effective for the class in nearly all solo or grouping situations. Well this all changed when the class changes happened with Rise of Isengard. After finding out that there are no major changes coming to the champion with Riders of Rohan; I decided now was a good time to make a case for the tanking champion.
I enjoy the champion because it is one of the most diverse melee classes in LOTRO. With a champion you can be single or AoE DPS or you can tank. This diversity allows you to fill nearly any melee role on the battlefield. If you’re running a skirmish and get lots of mobs then you can go AoE and then change on the fly to single target DPS or a tanking stance once you get to the boss fight at the end. This diversity is what has kept the champion as my uncontested main for several years now.
With RoI tanking is finally possible on the champion and so hopefully I can give a guide on what I have found to work. Since getting to cap I have played around and experimented a lot with the champion and these are the best tanking builds I have found so far.
Tanking Setups
Option 1
First off is what I like to think of as the true tank in that it is how Turbine wants your champion to tank. The first thing you need to do for this option is to be in Glory stance. Glory is the stance Turbine clearly wants you to tank in. You then need to go into blue trait line at least four deep to get the glory buff to your health along with extra critical defense and extra threat. For class traits I would recommend Call of the Wild, Aggressive Exchange, Reprisal, Bracing Attack and if you want a fifth for the legendary then I would recommend Vigour of Champions. I would not continue in blue line because it would not let you hold agro very well if you stayed in it for two more traits. I recommend increasing your critical rating with two red line traits: Vicious Strikes and Deadly strikes.
With this arrangement the choice of which virtues you want is really up to you because it will be hard to mess it up unless you pick things that no champion would want. You could go into more defensive traits or if you find you need more agro you could focus a little more on damage but really it would be hard to go wrong here with this setup.
For a Man’s Racial traits I would make sure I get Strength of Morale which will give you a nice heal. The only downside is that it is only available every hour. The rest of the racial traits are up to you really as none of them really stand out except for maybe Balance of Man if you really need extra defense.
For legendary traits I would recommend Invincible (if you want to go five deep in blue), Ferocious Strikes, Raging Blade, and Fight On. These traits will give you the extra agro and defense you need as a tank and should really help you out in a fight.
With this lineup you will have the defense you need to take on T2 Isen 3 and 6 mans with ease and you can even be the main tank in a T1 raid but I would not recommend being the main tank in a T2 raid.
This stance is great because it provides you with plenty defense and agro abilities that you will need to be the main tank.
Option 2
Option 2 is the option I use while tanking even though it is not considered to be a tanking stance, it is still a very viable way to tank. With this option you will want to be in fervor stance to get the best tanking effect.
This stance relies heavily on having the right virtues so that is where I will start this time. It is necessary to have these 5 in this option: Zeal, Determination, Justice, Loyalty and Valor. These virtues will give you a bunch of health and defense needed to tank.
With your man racial traits it is still the same as above.
Your class traits are where this option looks very unlike a tank. With this option you will want to go 4 deep in red line to get your trait equip buffs. The traits I would use from red line are: Vicious Strikes, Deadly Strikes, Blood-Lust and Deep Strikes. I then go 3 deep into yellow line to increase my multi-target agro abilities by increasing my damage by using these traits: Ardent Rage, Swift to Anger and Mighty Blast. These traits and buffs will allow you to hold agro and do plenty of damage while being able to take a lot of damage because of your virtues.
Legendary Traits are largely the same with the obvious exclusion of Invincible because you are not going deep in blue with this stance.
With this option I also have LI recommendations for this loadout by using the health increasing setting relics, the vitality increasing gem relics, the morale regen rune relics and finishing out with a crafted vitality. While these LI loadouts are optional I would highly recommend doing this on both of your LI’s to make you job as a tank much easier.
With this option I can be in everything as a main tank including T2 raids which is something I can’t really do in the other option. While this may just be me not getting something in the other one I have found a great way for me to do T2 raids as the main tank.
Option 3
Do you have a different way to tank as a champion? If so feel free to leave your option below.
General Tanking Recommendations and Tips
Regardless of which option you pick the following information applies to all champion tanks.
As a tank bubbles are very important especially since we get sudden defense which costs no power and has a small cooldown of three minutes. This skill is really important as a tank and should really be used whenever it can. On your LI you can get a legacy that takes this cooldown to only 1 min making it be even more effective. Also the more fervor you build, the better this skill becomes.
True Heroics is another great bubble skill as long as you are in a stance. When in a stance this skill will give you a bubble from 3000-6000 morale depending on your stance and is really essential. The only downside is that it has a 5 min cooldown which is not too long but still can feel like a long time when you are in the middle of a fight.
Dire Need is another great moral boost taking away a lot of power and then giving back a larger amount of morale. This skill can be improved to be even more effective and is highly recommended to use while tanking. Sadly this has a very long 10 min cooldown and usually can only be used once in a boss fight.
Bracing Attack is another great heal that also does damage to your enemy but is a great skill to spam while tanking considering every 30 sec it pops back up. It is made even better in Glory stance with an incoming healing buff.
That brings me to a big advantage champions have while tanking which is that one of their LI’s gives healing overtime. This is really important to improve this as a tank to get better heals from the healer. With a Second Age LI this is improved even more and you can easily get your incoming healing above 2000 which healers really notice and like.
As you might have noticed tanking is a very viable option now post RoI for champions and makes the class much more than just a damage machine and really allows you to play the champion how you want to play him. I really enjoy being able to easily switch between tanking and DPS with a simple trait change. I like both tanking and DPS and depending on the champions situation he (or she) can adapt making it a great class that is no longer just about DPS.
August 7, 2012 at 8:41 am
“Tanking on a champion was nearly impossible before Rise of Isengard.”
I must be imagining tanking the Moria instances then (60 cap) – including pulling the big spider and all the adds in Skumfil, where conventional tactics seem to have been tank takes boss only … and I was never more than adequately equipped, with a 2-2-3 trait set up.
I generally prefer heal/support classes, but those odd tanking outings were good fun
August 7, 2012 at 10:11 am
Nice!
August 7, 2012 at 9:08 am
How was the phrase “face-tanking” not included in a CSTM article on Champ tanks?
August 7, 2012 at 9:20 am
The face is too nice to tank with. I am much more of a foot tanker…nobody needs feet to tank. If you need to move just have your healer move you or learn how to do hand stands.
Also this is probably because the writer (whoever that is) probably forgot all about those episodes and articles.
August 7, 2012 at 9:18 am
One big thing I’d object to is spotting Fight On. Right now (and even going forward if the dev diary holds true) it is the moat useless of all champ legendaries and especially so when tanking in Glory. Already you are dealing with extreme power issues and the ICPR penalty from Fight On is just waaaaaayyyyyyy to big to justify the brief damage burst you get. Sure in pure DPS race situations (acid T2 cm, lightening T2 cm) you can use the burst dps but for longer boss fights and really everything.that isn’t a pure race (foundry, roots, shadow, Saruman). Again those example fights extra dps is needed and you are gonna have a bit of a race but they involve a lot more movement and positioning workthat stretches the fight and makes fight on an extreme liability.
Anyway the other option out there is always pure Fervour tanking but it requires a Cappy preferably with revealing mark at 20%. I’ve seen roots tanked with no healer just 2 cappies.
August 7, 2012 at 9:23 am
Actually if you need to get agro back fight on is pretty effective in a tanking stance. Other than that I agree that it is useless as a tank.
August 7, 2012 at 9:41 am
if you needed to get aggro back rising ire is a vastly superior option though. fight on needs an overhaul, it’s easily the least useful champ legendary.
August 7, 2012 at 10:04 am
There are times when rising ire is not enough especially if a really good hunter is going all out DPS and you need everything you can get and that makes fight on decent but yeah it could use improvement especially considering it is a legendary. To be really honest though all the legendaries except for feroucious strikes could use an improvement.
August 7, 2012 at 1:16 pm
I agree that all the champ legendary traits could use a review. The nerf to CB (while I understood it was balanced against the base-line improvements…) really annoyed me. But Fight On is still the most useless of all the champ traits.
Rising/Ebbing Ire is the best threat management skill we have. I’ve found that its more than sufficient for anything I need it to do, regardless of the other classes in the run. And if the hunter is outputting that much dps that they’re stealing threat, then they are not doing the job as a hunter! Hunters are meant to dps without drawing attention to themselves, so until the tank gets the mob locked down, no hunter should be using Heart Seeker. And even if that happens, rising ire would transfer enough threat back to the champ; combined with the hunter easing up on dps, problem solved.
August 7, 2012 at 11:15 am
Why include racial trait suggestions if you assume every champion is Race of Man? You might want to take a second look at your article…
August 7, 2012 at 11:53 am
Do you have any helpful suggestions that could be included?
August 7, 2012 at 12:25 pm
” Tanking on a champion was nearly impossible before Rise of Isengard”
One of my helpful suggestions would be stop making definitive staements based on…… what … feelings? It was never impossible or close to impossible pre Isengard. It comes down to the player and the skills they have with tanking. This part of LOTRO has always bothered me. People make assumptions and create bias and the community gradually adopts them. For an example, go look at glff or lff on your server and watch when people are recruiting for pug foundry or any instance I bet you will see things like ” LFM 5/6 need mini” . In this case they are looking for heals and not a minstrel but the bias that was created towards RK healing on Moria launch is now ingrained in the lotro community. I applaud the effort you made with this article though but lets not talk in absolutes.
August 7, 2012 at 12:53 pm
Even if possible pre-Isengard, I don’t think it was the norm. Also he is not talking in absolutes. He didn’t call it impossible he declared it nearly-impossible so his statement is not incorrect as you are both saying that it is in fact, a possibility.
I understand your complaint (as it is not a helpful suggestion at all in my opinion) is more towards the LOTRO community’s treatment of standards and you are simply using Andang as an example. I’d advise against that here at CSTM where we like to keep discussion positive and friendly.
If you have a long counter discussion on this or a whole article on class stereotypes, I suggest you type it up and send it in for a possible article on CSTM. We are not against opposing views or thoughts. I am however against un-neccessary negativity towards an author on CSTM who puts time and effort towards giving you content for nothing more than love of sharing.
August 8, 2012 at 2:51 am
I get that you want to keep it positive, but if it’s not being addressed with the author, then does it really matter if he or she is donating time? If you put it on the website and the arguments are directed at a developing pattern of less than attentive writing what other alternative do we have? I’m not saying pay writers either, but he either needs to work harder, have someone else proof read or stop writing them as guides. His first few articles were presented as purely opinion based articles, but I think as he has gotten more involved the tone has shifted. I really don’t think this is a case where it’s all “Internet negativity” but instead a simple statement that what is being represented on your site should be accountable. It’s not a grammar or spelling thing even…this is content based.
August 20, 2012 at 12:23 am
I thought that it might have been implied in the original post to which you replied. A helpful suggestion would be to research the other races that can play the champion class and report on the racial traits best suited in those cases or to eliminate that part of the article, as in the current form, it’s incomplete and presumptive.
August 7, 2012 at 1:47 pm
gimli = dwarf, so most champs are dwarves
August 7, 2012 at 3:58 pm
Men Champs?! Lame… Predictable…
Dwarves all the way!
August 8, 2012 at 9:55 am
I choose men as my race for two reasons….
1. Men can go really anywhere in Middle-Earth and it is feasible from a lore point of view but millions of hobbits, dwarves and elves in Rohan is really lore-breaking and I wish each race had different tasks and you played each for a different story. So for example men have stories in men places and elves have stories in elvan places.
2. I am a man…not an elf, dwarf, or hobbit and so I relate much better to men and it allows me to get more into my character from a lore point of view. Other people fit into other races…for example anyone who has seen Bandoras knows that he is a hobbit in both our world and Middle-Earth.
August 8, 2012 at 4:34 pm
You know I love ya, Andang
Just good old “Gimli” here giving “Aragorn” a hard time.
Truth be told, I am jealous of the Man racial heal ability. It’s the ONE tiny little factor that almost made me choose Man over Dwarf.
August 8, 2012 at 5:11 pm
@TylerMJonsson of course I knew but I also wanted to express why I only play Men. I think the other races are cool, they are just not for me.
August 7, 2012 at 1:09 pm
While this is a great guide to champ tanking, I really can’t agree that champs should be the main tank on ANY run. Sure, if its a 3-man and no one else can be found, that’s one thing. But MTing a bigger run should be left to guards or wardens.
IMO, champs excel better than any class at AOE DPS, and a full yellow build is the only thing I’ll do while in a group (run specific). No other class is built to output the same amount of AOE dps than a champ is, so while champ tanking is possible, I feel its more the exception than the rule.
August 7, 2012 at 3:01 pm
I love doing skirmishes all yellow because of the AoE DPS you can get but this was showing how tanking is a possibility since I think everyone knows about a champs normal role.
I might do an article on DPS builds if it seems needed.
August 9, 2012 at 12:26 am
Would love a different perspective (yours, Andang) on Champ DPS builds or best builds for solo play.
August 7, 2012 at 3:37 pm
You can pump out more AoE DPS by going at least 4 deep in red and staying in Fervour, largely due to faster pip generation.
August 8, 2012 at 9:56 am
Yep and the % added to damage does help
August 7, 2012 at 1:24 pm
The three best ways for a champ to tank any of the T2 Isen runs is by 1) DPS, 2) DPS, and 3) DPS. Stay in Fervour and hit lots of stuff really hard (meaning lots of shing-shing). We are especially ideal for tanking the 3 mans where we can take the damage while burning stuff down quickly.
If you are having problems holding aggro, then you need moar DPS. Controlled Burn is nice for that as is Continuous Blood Rage. If you have a Cappy in the group, the healing mark pretty much negates the CBR morale drain. I know some kins will use a CBR champ to tank T2 boss fights like the giants in F&F and it works well.
If Turbine really wants us to tank in Glory, then give us a real benefit to the stance such as changing our vit-to-morale ratio to 1:5 while in Glory. Thank you, though, for not suggesting that we need to get back nasty shields.
As for traits, Strength of Morale is nice but just a man trait. For the other traits, it is important to know what you are getting into before making a decision on what to trait. Tanking Orthanc trash (physical mitigations needed) is a completely different trait set-up than the boss fights (tactical mitigation needed).
August 7, 2012 at 1:30 pm
Disclaimer: I’ve never played a champ nor know anything about the class. I only play a hunter. On my server, Landroval, in the past 6+ months I’ve never been in a raid group where a champion is the main tank. As an off-tank for tough adds, absolutely I’ve seen champs be good off-tanks. But when it comes to taking those unbelievably heavy 10k+ damage hits from bosses, I’ve only seen guards or wardons be able to survive those, with massive healing and buffs of course too. Again, I’m not saying a champ can’t tank main raid/instance bosses, just saying I having seen any doing it. This is in contrast to say, maybe 2-3 years ago when it did seem to me I saw perfectly geared and traited champs tanking at least on the hard 6-person instances.
August 7, 2012 at 2:04 pm
I honestly did not think champs could tank until I healed one during roots of fangorn. I was very very impressed with what the class can do in a tanking situation.
August 7, 2012 at 3:05 pm
Like I said healers love to heal champs because of our high incoming healing but a few champs never get agro and so the healer can never take advantage of their incomming heals
August 7, 2012 at 8:30 pm
I have recently returned to my Champion, left languishing at lvl 30 while I played guardian, hunter and cappy this past year, and I am continually amazed at how well the class does. I am looking forward to working with this class fully.
thanks for this guide!
August 8, 2012 at 9:58 am
Stay with it as the class does become a lot of fun as you continue on
August 8, 2012 at 12:18 am
I’ve always enjoyed the challenge of tanking on my champ. I first started back in the Rift and Helegrod days back when it really was a challenge. My biggest achievement was a full rift clear as the main tank at lvl 50 on my elf champ. Later I realized the benefits of man champ and have since switched.
As for the changes with RoI, I’ve really liked them. I trait the following.
agressive exchange, braced against defeat, call of the wild, reprisal, tight grip, vicious strikes, and ardent rage.
Legendary traits are raging blade, controlled burn, and Invincible.
For gear, I build more incoming healing. (25.7% unbuffed) As for legendary items, I use the following on my rune:
ardour/glory parry & evade, swift strike power, bracing attack heal, blade line power, hedge armour rating, ardour/glory in-combat power.
On my sword I use wild attack, relentless, crit multiplier, battle frenzy, sudden defense cooldown, and vitality.
All of my setting, gem, runes are morale, ich, icm based. Morale is ~14.5K unbuffed if I go all out.
The kin I’m in has been using champ tank on T2 shadow. When I’m tanking it, I keep hedge, bracing attack and adamant up as often as possible, use wild attack and blade-wall as often as possible and use the bubbles when I’m getting low on health.
August 8, 2012 at 5:06 am
Zooom… right over my head.
I have never played any of the online games. The use of over-the-top graphic imagery tended to push me away.
And my own conception of Middle-earth tends to make it difficult for me to accept the premises for a Middle-earth online game.
But…
It certainly looks compelling at times.
And…
It is something that I am actually working toward providing a similar experience – although not in a “game” format so much. I have been working on creating a more “realistic” (closer to the atmosphere that JRR Tolkien and Christopher Tolkien set forth) experience for a Middle-earth “game,” and the “game” part of it would have very different emphasis (with less emphasis on fighting – most of the “fights” would be entirely scripted affairs. The “game” portion would be in decisions as to where and when to fight, and toward long-term goals.
But… I suppose that I need to see what is already out there in order to understand the medium.
August 8, 2012 at 6:21 am
This is certainly not the type of posts to start with for someone who has never played the game.
August 8, 2012 at 8:53 am
So Andang,
I was wondering if you could say why the “proper” tanking setup(ie Glory + Blue) line seems to let you tank less than your Fervour stance champ? (you say you can tank T2 reaids in fervour stance, but not in Glory!)
I don’t play a champ, but an outside veiw this seems weird, blue line glory champs seem to have superior aggro and surviability.
In any case I appreciate the article I tank on my captain, so I too love showing what you can do with your class in an unconventional role if you know what your doing (Captains have an even worse rep than champions for tanking…)
August 8, 2012 at 10:01 am
Glory being the “proper” thanking stance was strait from Turbine when they made the Isen champion changes.
August 8, 2012 at 10:02 am
Also note that some cappies have amazing tanking skills as I have seen them be the main tank in T2 ToO.
August 8, 2012 at 11:10 am
For me i trait all blue when tanking i can easly hold agro off a hunter with out having to put out much damage. I am traited so i can allways have hedge up while in combat which is great for extra parry and armour. I have the +X% bracing attack heal maxed out as well as the sudden defence bubble CD down to 1 min plus every wild attack reduces it even more. I also have Invincible at 1 min CD and when in combat i build up my fervour to 5 use braceing attack (no fervour cost) then use sudden defence then spam wild attack and swift strike to build up more fervour then i pop invincible till my bubble is off CD and pretty much repeat over and over.
August 8, 2012 at 11:11 am
srry nvm mind u realised it was tanking not soloing that was my soloing stuff i never really tank u can just ignore that old post
August 8, 2012 at 11:11 am
I realised*
August 9, 2012 at 1:07 pm
While not a champ, love to see an article on playing other than the standard role. As a LM main, I heal 3 mans, a lot of fun and different than just DPS/Debuff. This in cludes using a champ/cappy as the tank and and other classes to fill out.
It definitly is more about people who can play thier class vrs the button pushers.
August 10, 2012 at 6:42 am
Maybe you could write up an article on “why Andang plays the defiler” with tips and tactics that you personally have found useful?
August 10, 2012 at 11:30 am
I am planning to be starting over with PvP on Landroval when the RoR PvP update is released and will be writing several articles to that effect.
Thanks for letting me know that somebody wants those kinds of articles.
August 11, 2012 at 9:42 am
thumbs up for the effort, but honestly, your guide is rather incomplete and you failed to mention a few important things.
I’ll just list them out for the ease of reading:
1) Bracing attack only gives an incoming healing buff when traited; it has nothing to do with glory
2) glory reduces cooldowns of certain skills (bracing attack, hedge, invincible/adamant)
3) going 4 deep in glory will enable the exalted combatant effect which will heal for a nice chunk of morale when you hit a certain morale threshold (2 min CD)
4) True Heroics has a threat generating bonus in glory (and other bonuses in other two stances)
5) for fervour tanking, it is MUCH more important to trait flurry of blows than deep strikes
7) controlled burn is a very good legendary trait to have, both in glory and fervour tanking (in fervour, it will activate an improved version of exchange of blows that lasts for as long as you are in combat and in glory it is an excellent thing to have for increased icpr)
8) for fervour tanking going with CBR is a good idea, since it will give you an edge in holding aggro agains other dps classes
9) dual wield is superior to 2H for tanking. it will give you an increased chance to hit with bracing attack and you will be able to fire off your survival skils faster